Private Revelations and Obedience to the Catholic Church by: Glenn Dallaire
Obedience to the Catholic Church has always been the “litmus test” that that Church uses for discerning the authenticity of a mystic or visionary and their alleged private revelations. A true mystic or visionary will always obey the legitimate religious superiors and authorities in the Church. We can be sure that if a mystic or seer is in any way disobedient to the local Bishop or their religious Superiors, then the alleged revelations and messages cannot be authentic. God's graces flow through His Church in union with the legitimate authority (ie- Pope, Bishops, Religious Superiors) that He Himself has established.
Jesus established the authority in the Catholic Church through the Apostles, with Peter as their Head. Through Apostolic and Papal succession, the Bishops are the successors to the Apostles, with the Pope (Peter) as the Head. And, as successors to the Apostles, it is the Bishops duty to safeguard and protect the faithful in the purity of the Catholic faith. The very real danger in following an alleged visionary is that one can very easily be led astray by the erroneous teachings and revelations of a false mystic or visionary. In fact, throughout the centuries, some Catholics have been led out of the Church by false visionaries and seers.
The authority to judge, and the obligation of the faithful to obey
“We belong to God, and anyone who knows God listens to us, while anyone who does not belong to God refuses to hear us. This is how we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of deceit.” (1 John 4:6)
The “us” John is referring to is Peter and his fellow Apostles and their successors, that is, the Pope and the Bishops. Obedience to “us” is the key that John gives us to “knowing the spirit of truth and the spirit of deceit”. The Catholic Church, through the inspiration and guidance of the Holy Spirit given to the Pope and the Bishops alone has the authority to judge the private revelations of mystics and visionaries, and it is our obligation and duty to obey the judgment of the Church. Catholics should be aware that willful disobedience to the Church is a sin. Willful disobedience is when one knowingly and intentionally disobeys the legitimate authority and judgment of the Church. (ie- local Bishop). Even should the local Bishop mistakenly disapprove of a genuine revelation, obedience to the Church always remains paramount. It is a sin to propagate a private revelation disobediently, but it can never be a sin not to propagate one.
While we are free to have an personal opinion regarding a private revelation, we must submit to the judgment of the Church with practical obedience. What this means is that while we are free to disagree privately with a Bishops decision, (the Bishop is not infallible these matters), we are obligated to obey with practical obedience, that is, we may not act against the Bishops decree or judgment; we may not propagate the private revelation or alleged messages that the Bishop has judged negatively, or continue to say publicly that you regard it as genuine. No private individual has the authority to judge definitively and officially which private revelations are true and which are not. The authority to rule on the authenticity of a private revelation rests solely with the local Bishop.
Setting up Christ against His Church
Authentic mystics, like Saint Pio of Pietrelcina, St Teresa of Avila, St Catherine of Siena and St Margaret Mary Alacoque are models of obedience. They never pretended to set up Christ against His Church through the revelations that they were given . In fact, there are countless occasions in the lives of the Saints where Our Lord gave them a directive, but then their religious superior or spiritual director forbade it. On every one of these occasions in the lives of the Saints, Jesus always instructed them to obey the directives of their religious superior, even when they were against His own directives or wishes.
Concerning a Mystic or private revelation one might say "That Bishop is a bad Bishop. I think the Bishop is wrong and his judgement is incorrect".
Obedience to the Catholic Church has always been the “litmus test” that that Church uses for discerning the authenticity of a mystic or visionary and their alleged private revelations. A true mystic or visionary will always obey the legitimate religious superiors and authorities in the Church. We can be sure that if a mystic or seer is in any way disobedient to the local Bishop or their religious Superiors, then the alleged revelations and messages cannot be authentic. God's graces flow through His Church in union with the legitimate authority (ie- Pope, Bishops, Religious Superiors) that He Himself has established.
Jesus established the authority in the Catholic Church through the Apostles, with Peter as their Head. Through Apostolic and Papal succession, the Bishops are the successors to the Apostles, with the Pope (Peter) as the Head. And, as successors to the Apostles, it is the Bishops duty to safeguard and protect the faithful in the purity of the Catholic faith. The very real danger in following an alleged visionary is that one can very easily be led astray by the erroneous teachings and revelations of a false mystic or visionary. In fact, throughout the centuries, some Catholics have been led out of the Church by false visionaries and seers.
The authority to judge, and the obligation of the faithful to obey
“We belong to God, and anyone who knows God listens to us, while anyone who does not belong to God refuses to hear us. This is how we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of deceit.” (1 John 4:6)
The “us” John is referring to is Peter and his fellow Apostles and their successors, that is, the Pope and the Bishops. Obedience to “us” is the key that John gives us to “knowing the spirit of truth and the spirit of deceit”. The Catholic Church, through the inspiration and guidance of the Holy Spirit given to the Pope and the Bishops alone has the authority to judge the private revelations of mystics and visionaries, and it is our obligation and duty to obey the judgment of the Church. Catholics should be aware that willful disobedience to the Church is a sin. Willful disobedience is when one knowingly and intentionally disobeys the legitimate authority and judgment of the Church. (ie- local Bishop). Even should the local Bishop mistakenly disapprove of a genuine revelation, obedience to the Church always remains paramount. It is a sin to propagate a private revelation disobediently, but it can never be a sin not to propagate one.
While we are free to have an personal opinion regarding a private revelation, we must submit to the judgment of the Church with practical obedience. What this means is that while we are free to disagree privately with a Bishops decision, (the Bishop is not infallible these matters), we are obligated to obey with practical obedience, that is, we may not act against the Bishops decree or judgment; we may not propagate the private revelation or alleged messages that the Bishop has judged negatively, or continue to say publicly that you regard it as genuine. No private individual has the authority to judge definitively and officially which private revelations are true and which are not. The authority to rule on the authenticity of a private revelation rests solely with the local Bishop.
Setting up Christ against His Church
Authentic mystics, like Saint Pio of Pietrelcina, St Teresa of Avila, St Catherine of Siena and St Margaret Mary Alacoque are models of obedience. They never pretended to set up Christ against His Church through the revelations that they were given . In fact, there are countless occasions in the lives of the Saints where Our Lord gave them a directive, but then their religious superior or spiritual director forbade it. On every one of these occasions in the lives of the Saints, Jesus always instructed them to obey the directives of their religious superior, even when they were against His own directives or wishes.
Concerning a Mystic or private revelation one might say "That Bishop is a bad Bishop. I think the Bishop is wrong and his judgement is incorrect".
Such a sentiment or statement implies that God is not guiding His Church or those He has placed in authority over it. Even if the Bishop was a "bad Bishop", God still works through him, in respect to his Office as Bishop and Shepherd. Sinful or not, faulty or not, God ALWAYS has power over His creatures, especially the Shepherds who represent Him and His Church. Even if the Bishop is incorrect in his judgement of a mystic or private revelation, one is always correct in obeying his judgement.
Those who disobey the negative judgement of the local Bishop concerning a mystic defend their disobedience to the Bishop by saying- "I would rather believe in God than man", which is really saying that God has no power over the very bishop that He commands us to obey, and that God, through the Holy Spirit, does not enlighten the Bishop, or influence him to make the proper judgment. This person, therefore, becomes their own bishop, judge and authority, apart from Christ's Church. In other words, such persons would rather believe in the mystic than the Church, and thereby set up Christ against His Church.
Can a bishop make an error in discernement and judgement of a private revelation? Yes, if God permits it. The Church teaches us that private revelations are never to be held as the source or the basis of our faith, and as Catholics we are not required to believe in any of them, not even the Church approved ones such as Lourdes or Fatima. Only the doctrines and teachings of the Church are to be our sole guide and rule of our faith. And God, to emphasise this fact, and to test our humility and obedience to those He has placed in authority in His Church, can permit a Bishop to make an negative judgement concerning an authentic mystic or private revelation. But even if such is the case, one is always obligated to obey the judgement of the local Bishop in matters of faith and morals.
The Example of the Saints
On one occasion, the Sacred Heart of Jesus made a request to St Margaret Mary Alocoque, but when she told her Superior this request, her Superior did not approve. Soon afterwards, when Jesus came to her again, she asked Him about this, and He replied: "…not only do I desire that you should do what your Superior commands, but also that you should do nothing of all that I request of you without their consent. I love obedience, and without it no one can please Me" [Autobiography of St Margaret Mary].
Elsewhere in her Autobiography, we read that St Margaret Mary was told by Our Lord: "Listen, My daughter, and do not lightly believe and trust every spirit, for Satan is angry and will try to deceive you. So do nothing without the approval of those who guide you. Being thus under the authority of obedience, his efforts against you will be in vain, for he has no power over the obedient" [cf. -Autobiography]
In the life of St Pio of Pietrelcina (Padre Pio) we discover that his Bishop, Archbishop Gagliardi, falsely accused Padre Pio of various wrongdoings, and had unjust sanctions imposed upon him. When people would speak against the Bishop concerning these unjust sanctions, St. Pio would quickly respond “The will of the Bishop is the will of God.” Conscious of the importance of obedience, Padre Pio was always showing an example of true religious obedience and respect to his superiors. For him, the superior was the image of Christ, and obeying him was obeying Christ. But it happened that God used Padre Pio's superiors as instruments for him to suffer from the Church, and for the Church. And so we see that even if the Bishop may be wrong in his judgment, we are always doing God's will by obeying him.
In the Diary of St Faustina Kowalska we read:
"...Jesus says; 'Obedience. I have come to do My Father’s will. I obeyed my Parents, I obeyed My tormentors and now I obey the Priests' ...I understood that our efforts, no matter how great, are not pleasing to God if they do not bear the seal of obedience.... I understand, O Jesus, the spirit of obedience and in what it consists. It includes not only external actions, but also one’s reason, will and judgment. In obeying our superiors, we obey God.." -Diary of Saint Faustina Kowalska
And elsewhere in her diary she writes: "Satan can even clothe himself in a cloak of humility, but he does not know how to wear the cloak of obedience." (Diary, par. 939).
And St Catherine of Siena states- “Oh! How sweet and glorious is this virtue of obedience, which contains all the other virtues! Because it is born of charity, and on it the rock of the holy Faith is founded; it is a queen, and he who espouses it knows no evil, but only peace and rest.”
The life of the false mystic Sr. Magdalena de la Cruz should be a very stark warning to all about the grave dangers of being misled by a false visionary or mystic. During her youth, Sr. Magdalena made a pact with the devil and eventually became a Franciscan nun, and then the mother Prioress of her convent. She became famous for her (false) mystical graces, prophesies, stigmata, visions etc, and ended up misleading many within the Church, along with numerous high dignitaries throughout Spain and abroad. Those interested can read an article on Sr. Magdalena of the Cross that I wrote here
All that glitters is not necessarily gold, and the devil does not counterfeit tin or copper---he seeks to counterfeit gold. So, Catholics need to be very careful not to be misled by the false gold of phony visionaries and mystics.
In closing, I highly recommend Father Peter Joseph’s excellent article concerning the discernment of apparitions and obedience to the local Bishop located here: http://www.christianorder.com/features/features_2004/features_oct04.html
Those who disobey the negative judgement of the local Bishop concerning a mystic defend their disobedience to the Bishop by saying- "I would rather believe in God than man", which is really saying that God has no power over the very bishop that He commands us to obey, and that God, through the Holy Spirit, does not enlighten the Bishop, or influence him to make the proper judgment. This person, therefore, becomes their own bishop, judge and authority, apart from Christ's Church. In other words, such persons would rather believe in the mystic than the Church, and thereby set up Christ against His Church.
Can a bishop make an error in discernement and judgement of a private revelation? Yes, if God permits it. The Church teaches us that private revelations are never to be held as the source or the basis of our faith, and as Catholics we are not required to believe in any of them, not even the Church approved ones such as Lourdes or Fatima. Only the doctrines and teachings of the Church are to be our sole guide and rule of our faith. And God, to emphasise this fact, and to test our humility and obedience to those He has placed in authority in His Church, can permit a Bishop to make an negative judgement concerning an authentic mystic or private revelation. But even if such is the case, one is always obligated to obey the judgement of the local Bishop in matters of faith and morals.
The Example of the Saints
On one occasion, the Sacred Heart of Jesus made a request to St Margaret Mary Alocoque, but when she told her Superior this request, her Superior did not approve. Soon afterwards, when Jesus came to her again, she asked Him about this, and He replied: "…not only do I desire that you should do what your Superior commands, but also that you should do nothing of all that I request of you without their consent. I love obedience, and without it no one can please Me" [Autobiography of St Margaret Mary].
Elsewhere in her Autobiography, we read that St Margaret Mary was told by Our Lord: "Listen, My daughter, and do not lightly believe and trust every spirit, for Satan is angry and will try to deceive you. So do nothing without the approval of those who guide you. Being thus under the authority of obedience, his efforts against you will be in vain, for he has no power over the obedient" [cf. -Autobiography]
In the life of St Pio of Pietrelcina (Padre Pio) we discover that his Bishop, Archbishop Gagliardi, falsely accused Padre Pio of various wrongdoings, and had unjust sanctions imposed upon him. When people would speak against the Bishop concerning these unjust sanctions, St. Pio would quickly respond “The will of the Bishop is the will of God.” Conscious of the importance of obedience, Padre Pio was always showing an example of true religious obedience and respect to his superiors. For him, the superior was the image of Christ, and obeying him was obeying Christ. But it happened that God used Padre Pio's superiors as instruments for him to suffer from the Church, and for the Church. And so we see that even if the Bishop may be wrong in his judgment, we are always doing God's will by obeying him.In the Diary of St Faustina Kowalska we read:
"...Jesus says; 'Obedience. I have come to do My Father’s will. I obeyed my Parents, I obeyed My tormentors and now I obey the Priests' ...I understood that our efforts, no matter how great, are not pleasing to God if they do not bear the seal of obedience.... I understand, O Jesus, the spirit of obedience and in what it consists. It includes not only external actions, but also one’s reason, will and judgment. In obeying our superiors, we obey God.." -Diary of Saint Faustina Kowalska
And elsewhere in her diary she writes: "Satan can even clothe himself in a cloak of humility, but he does not know how to wear the cloak of obedience." (Diary, par. 939).
And St Catherine of Siena states- “Oh! How sweet and glorious is this virtue of obedience, which contains all the other virtues! Because it is born of charity, and on it the rock of the holy Faith is founded; it is a queen, and he who espouses it knows no evil, but only peace and rest.”
The life of the false mystic Sr. Magdalena de la Cruz should be a very stark warning to all about the grave dangers of being misled by a false visionary or mystic. During her youth, Sr. Magdalena made a pact with the devil and eventually became a Franciscan nun, and then the mother Prioress of her convent. She became famous for her (false) mystical graces, prophesies, stigmata, visions etc, and ended up misleading many within the Church, along with numerous high dignitaries throughout Spain and abroad. Those interested can read an article on Sr. Magdalena of the Cross that I wrote here
All that glitters is not necessarily gold, and the devil does not counterfeit tin or copper---he seeks to counterfeit gold. So, Catholics need to be very careful not to be misled by the false gold of phony visionaries and mystics.
In closing, I highly recommend Father Peter Joseph’s excellent article concerning the discernment of apparitions and obedience to the local Bishop located here: http://www.christianorder.com/features/features_2004/features_oct04.html
Additionally, for those interested I have written another article on this subject entitled "Mystics and Visionaries in the world today" that includes a bit of my own personal experiences with mystics and also some more thoughts on judging and discernment.
21 comments:
What about the situation in Medjugorge where the Vatican has (allegedly?) taken authority over the matter?
Hi Anonymous,
Not only Medjugorje but also supporters of other visionaries/ apparitions often declare that judgement has been taken away from the local Bishop, and that it is the Vatican who now has the authority to judge the auhenticity of the alleged events....in other words, "the judgement is in the hands of the Vatican"
In reply I will not address Medjugorje or any other current apparition specifically, but will simply state the normal Church procedure concerning discernement and judgement of alleged private revelations.
Under almost all circumstances, the Ordinary (local Bishop) alone has the authority to judge a private revelation or apparition within his diocese.
In such cases as Lourdes, Fatima, Guadalupe etc, Rome and/or the Pope simply "recognise" the local Bishops approval. This is officially called a "Recognito".
Except for very rare circumstances, the Vatican and/or the Pope does not "approve" or authenticate private revelations or apparitions. The Vatican simply recognises the Local Bishops approval (or disapproval).
A Bishop may appoint a Commission or ask a Regional or National Bishops Conference to assist him in discerning, but once again it is the local Bishop, as the successor to the Apostles, who firstly and normally has the sole authority to judge the authenticity of a private revelation.
If a apparition has a Regional or National significance, or if the local Bishop has requested it, then it is *possible* that the Vatican may issue a judgement as to its authenticity, but this is very rare and is not normal Church procedure.
Having studied many mystics/visionaries/apparitions, I have never discovered a single occasion where the Pope or the Vatican over-ruled a local Bishops negative decision. I do not believe that this has ever happened in the 2000 year history of the Church. so I find it highly unlikely that the Vatican would ever rule in favor of a visionary or apparition that the local Bishop had previously given a negative judgement.
In other words, the suggestion of certain followers of some current visionaries or apparitions that the Pope or the Vatican will officially "override" a Bishops lawful negative decision is something that has never happened in the 20 centuries of the Church.
Simply put, the point is that the Vatican and/or the Pope almost never formally make judgements concerning the authenticity of private revelations /apparitions/ visionaries, and they certainly do not overrule a local Bishops lawful judgement as to the authenticity of a rivate revelation occuring within his Diocese.
The local Bishop, as the successor of the apostles, is the sole authority and shepherd of the flock in matters of safe guarding the faith and morals within his diocese and of judging the authenticity of apparitions and private revelations occurring within his diocese....this in part, is why the Bishops are called "shepherds" and "princes" of the Church.
Concerning a negative decision by a local Bishop, what can happen ON VERY RARE OCCASIONS is that a later local Bishop, that is, a sucessor to this current one, can reverse the PREVIOUS Bishops decision, (or he can appoint a Commission or a Regional or National Bishops Conference who can reverse the decision). Historically this is VERY rare, but it has happened to some extent even recently for example in Amsterdam, concerning the "Lady of all Nations" and her appearences to the visionary Ida Peerdeman for example.
This point is so important that I must state it again: What is really at stake is fidelity and obedience (or disobedience) to the Catholic Church. Even if under rare conditions an apparition or private revelation is a special case whereby the judgement as to its authenticity in the hands of the Vatican , the faithful are OBLIGATED TO OBEY THE LOCAL BISHOPS DECISION(S) UNTIL IF/WHEN THE VATICAN MAKES A RULING.
Thanks for the question and may God bless you,
Glenn Dallaire
+fiat+ ... i'm desiring to be OBEDIENT to the official church stand regarding maria valtorta & her writings, an also our local locutionists carlos lopez & jorge zavala here in san bruno california ... or please direct me to another site ... praised be jesus & mary ... thank you
Hi Anonymous,
Thanks for your comment. Unfortunately I am not familiar with Mr Carlos Lopez & Jorge Zavala. Perhaps you can contact the local Diocese for San Bruno, California to see if the local Bishop has made any judgements concerning either of them.
With in regards to the Italian Mystic Maria Valtorta, there are several excellent websites on the Internet that discuss the Church position concerning "The Poem of the Man-God" written by her. As for myself, I have read "The Poem of the Man-God" and I found it to be very inspiring and edifying. However, I am not in a position to judge its authenticity -that is for the Church to decide.
May God bless you and yours!
-Glenn Dallaire
Dear Anonymous,
In response to your question regarding Maria Valtorta's work, The Poem of the Man God, the official church position took a turn in the 1980'2 from where it presently rests. Unfortunately much mis-information still floats around regarding this work even today.
Back in the 1980's the Church came out with many contrary opinions in response from the iitial "approval" given by Pope Pius XII which said "let the faithful read it"...You can google "Pope Pius XII's rsponse and see the circumstances that followed by various bishops and Pope John who chimed in on their opinions.
Back in the 1980's, again this work came to the forefront and was negatively criticized by many EWTN employees, (one of which was Fr. Mitch Pacwa). the4 comments made which of course were," personal" opinion led to the Vatican reviewing the Church's official position on the work since there was obviously conflicting sentiments; which you can read for yourself after googling this info...
To clarify, in the mid 1990's the Vatican released a statement that while they did not feel that there was anything that was "supernatural" about the work, that it contained no moral or doctrinal errors that would put the faithful in any danger who wished to read it.
The stir that caused much of the debate was from statements made in Volume 1,(I think it was Volume 1)where the Blessed Virgin Mary allegedly tells St.Anne (her mother) something to the effect of "oh mummy, I wish that I could be a sinner (only once) to be able to experiencef the great love, forgiveness, and mercy of our God. In no way was Mary trying to imply that she wanted to offend God by commiting a sin,( this would be impossible and a contradiction that Holy Mother Church made proclaiming the Mother of God, free from sin and Immaculate), but rather was defining her understanding given at that early age as to God's great Mercy.
To further confuse matters, it has allegedly been said to some of the visionaries in Medjugorje, when the question was posed to our Lady about Maria Valtorta's work "if it can be read", and our Lady's response was allegedly, "It is real and can be read". What was interesting about that would be that our Lady would NEVER go against the Church's hierarchy's decision so like the great split that exists by many in the Church whether our Lady's appearences are real or not, recently Cardinal Schonburn affirmedthe chucrch's position that "while nothing to date can be declared supernatural or not supernatural, the faithful can go to Medjugorje, and are encouraged to go, as "Pope John Paul II" affirmed when he said, "Medgugorje is a place of prayer and great fruits.
I hope that this help clears up the confusion for you?
God's Peace!
Thank you Paul for the clarification and explanations.
As you point out there is indeed a good amount of information on the Internet concerning the Church position on Maria Valtorta's "Poem of the Man-God" for those who are interested.
May God bless you and yours!
-Glenn Dallaire
I have had some dreams and have seen unusual things.In these occurrences, I have not been given a specific message or order, I believe they are signal graces. I have spoken to my Priest about them. Should I also speak to the Bishop?
Your Sister in Christ, Christina
Hi Christina,
It is a pleasure to meet you. You have certainly done the right thing by consulting a priest concerning the graces that you have received.
Without knowing the specific nature of the graces, I will simply reply with the old adage-
"The mystic that has herself for a spiritual director has a fool for a guide."
-In other words, mystical graces should normally be submitted to the Church through the hands of its ministers (ie.-priests)
The only time one would want to inform the local Bishop would be if the messages received were of a public nature, concerning the Church as a whole, such as in the messages of Fatima, for example.
Otherwise, mystical graces are normally submitted to the Church through its ordinary ministers.
I pray that God may bless you and draw you ever closer to Himself.
-Glenn Dallaire
Dear Christina,
God's Peace! and a Happy Easter to you. I left a comment on this post back in January responding to your question regarding the mystic Maria Valtorta.
In response to your most recent post concerning your dreams and the unusual things which you have seen, there would not be a need or requirement to discuss or disclose anything with the Bishop unless you were directed to do so by the priest whom you spoke to or others in church authority.
Without getting too personal, as Glenn said well, only you will truly know what to do with the information and "signal graces" which you have received. To comment further about this would be purely speculative and foolish to do as I am not exactly sure what you are referring to; however, remember this...that it is God's choice and perogative to gift or do what He desires with a soul. It may not be necessary to share what He might prefer you keep as personal, just for you; unless of course He directs you to do otherwise or unless you had reservations or concerns about what you have received. (In either case you already have done the prudent thing by referring your questions and concerns to the priest that you have spoken with about this)
Just a helpful thought Christina, but I would pray and ask our Lord and the Holy Spirit to show you what to do. No worries then! Do remember that if it is God's desire for this to be made known to others, by being obedient to His desires, you will be given the grace and direction to do what He asks. But do be careful that it is not your need to share what He may wishes to remain intimately personal and intended just for you.
Whatever you decide to do, accept these graces in humility and with deep gratitude to Him and continue to pray.... I hope this helps?
Paul
Thanks Paul for your excellent comments. You brought out an excellent point about the distinction between revelations that are only for the individual person involved, and other revelations which are for the enlightenment of others, and the building up of the Church.
Union in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary,
Glenn
Thank you Glen and Paul.
Our Parish is blessed with a very young and new Priest. And, I am a Catholic convert and have been appointed as the DRE of our Parish.
I pray earnestly and sincerely for the Blessed Mother to use me as her tool to teach her children what she wants them to learn. In my dreams, I have never been told something that I must tell others and I have had no inspirations that I even need to share anything with anyone. I am instructed (by whom I believe is the Blessed Mother) what she wants me to teach the children. These include going into detail about the 10 Commandments, How to Pray the Rosary, How to Pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet and the significance of the 7 Sacraments as unbreakable Covenants with God (from God's point of view).
I have always questioned whether or not these dreams are of holy origin, evil or just me making things up in my head. But, thanks to your site, I am reassured that if anything goes against the doctrine of the Church or what the Bishop commands, (whether I like it or not), that it could not have heavenly origin. I believe it was St. Faustina who said that Satan can not wear the cloak of obedience. My sole desire is obedience to God, The Blessed Mother, the Pope, my Bishop, my priest, true Catholic doctrine and traditions and last, but not least, Holy Scriptures.
I am not the other anonymous person who posted about "fiat". But, I understand anonymous' desire to be obedient just as Mary was when she said "fiat" to God's Will.
After sharing with my godmother that I often pray and sing alone to the Lord in our church, and that the last few times Jesus on the Crucifix became real to me, and the very last time, he looked at me, she said this is something that she reads that mystics and Saints have seen. I was also extremely worried that I had the wrong reaction when I was terrified when Our Lord looked at me. I was worried that I had offended Him. She reassured me that many others have felt fear as well. I had never known of what a mystic is, so this is how I came to your site. Within a half hour of Our Lord looking at me, while I was singing "Open the Eyes of My Heart" to him, a very sick parishioner called me from the hospital. He is charge of the Alter Servers and he rarely ever calls me. I felt that I needed to tell him what happened. He told me that Jesus was telling me that I am on the right path, that he sees me and that I am doing good. He said, "you sang, I want to see You", and so he did what you asked.
I have prayed about what I have seen and drempt. I believe The Holy Spirit guided me here so I can see the words of saints and mystics (and know that I am not insane, lol) Thank you so much for your hard work. I pray that The Lord and our Blessed Mother continue to bless you with fortitude. May your hearts always burn with desire for Christ.
Your Sister in Christ,
Christina
Hi Christina,
Thank you for sharing a bit of your spiritual journey with us.
I agree with the gentleman who is in charge of the altar servers when he said that you are on the right path. Remain humble and loving and you will most certainly continue to please our Lord. I think you did well by informing your priest of the graces that you have received.
Keep in touch and may God bless you and may He continue to draw you ever closer to Himself!
Union in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary,
Glenn Dallaire
I'm convinced that the events at Medjugorje are genuine; that Mary is appearing to the visionaries. The allegation that they disobeyed the bishop is unfounded. However, even though "Obedience" has been the litmus test in the past, it may not be appropriate in the present. Isn't there a prophecy indicating that satan will enter the Church. One hint is as follows: The Akita prophecy, in part, contains the following: "The work of the devil will infiltrate even into the Church in such a way that one will see cardinals opposing cardinals, bishops against bishops. The priests who venerate Me will be scorned and opposed by their confreres … churches and altars sacked; the Church will be full of those who accept compromises and the demon will press many priests and consecrated souls to leave the service of the Lord."
To be honest telling people to show obedience to the church is so over the top.
Consider the work of the Church in the abuse of children in Ireland and Belgium and other countries. Consider the cover up after cover up. To quote the Taoiseach (Prime Minister) Enda Kenny in Ireland
"The rape and the torture of children were downplayed or managed to uphold, instead, the primacy of the institution, its power, its standing, and its reputation. Far from listening to evidence of humiliation and betrayal with St. Benedict's "ear of the heart", the Vatican's reaction was to parse and analyse it with the gimlet eye of a canon-lawyer. This calculated, withering position being the polar opposite of the radicalism, the humility, and the compassion upon which the Roman Church was founded; the radicalism, the humility, and the compassion which are the very essence of its foundation and its purpose; the behaviour being a case of Roma locuta est: causa finita est, except in this instance, a Cheann Comhairle, nothing could be further from the truth"
This is what the Church have done and we have to obey them. No way. Jesus loved children - and our church inflicted untold damage on the most vulnerable- children. However as bad as that is, the Church went out of her way to cover it up.
Seriously the Catholic Church is corrupt from the top to the bottom.
Hi Anonymous,
Thank you for your comments.
The problem with your position is that it condradicts what Jesus taught in the Gospel about the authority that God gives to His representatives. Neither myself nor anyone in the Catholic church could argue that the Pope or the Bishops are perfect, or without sin----in fact, there are certain Bishops who are living very sinful and scandalous lives, far from the Gospel and the calling that they have received.
Nevertheless in Matthew 23:1-3, Jesus speaks about the absolute necessity of obedience to God's representatives and the authority He has given to them:
"Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying, “The scribes and the Pharisees have taken their seat on the chair of Moses. Therefore, do and observe all things whatsoever they tell you, but do not follow their example. For they preach but they do not practice." (Mt 23:1-3)
So, it is not a matter of the holiness or the sinfulness of certain Bishop(s), but it is the seat of authority and the position that God has given them that we are to obey.
And likewise again speaking about the authority of Peter (the first Pope) Jesus said in Matthew 16:18-19:
"And I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it. I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”
Peter was commissioned by Jesus to be the first Pope and in the above Gospel Jesus once again Jesus stresses the authority given to Peter. The succession (that is the line) of Popes from Peter until our current Pope Benedict is unbroken, and our current Pope is the 265th Pope since Peter.
Along with Peter the first Pope, the apostles where the first Bishops, and through the laying of hands in succession from the Apostles to the Bishops after them have never been broken. This "Apostolic succession" from the Apostles to the moder day Bishops has also never been broken, and their authority and commision by Jesus continues to this day.
And Jesus continues to repeat the commission and authority of the apostles-bishops in many Gospels, such as:
"Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, even so I send you." (Jn 20:21)
Or again:
"He who receives you receives Me, and he who receives Me receives Him who sent Me." (Mt 10:40)
And again:
"He who hears you hears Me, and he who rejects you rejects Me, and he who rejects Me rejects Him who sent Me." (Lk 10:16)
So, it is Jesus Himself who upon instituting His Church, ordered and gave authority in His name to the Pope and Bishops, and obedience is due them regardless of and individual Bishops faults, weaknesses or sins. And this why, prior to instituting His Church, when the Jewish Church still posessed the God given authority, Jesus said:
“The scribes and the Pharisees have taken their seat on the chair of Moses. Therefore, do and observe all things whatsoever they tell you, but do not follow their example. For they preach but they do not practice." (Mt 23:1-3)
The Pope and the Bishops in communion with him possess the authority of Christ, supported and guided by the presence of the Holy Spirit. (Read the Book of Acts 15:28-35)
And so, with all due respect, we can see that that your position contradicts the teachings of Jesus in the Gospels.
May God bless you and your loved ones,
Glenn Dallaire
And so, with all due respect, we can see that that your position contradicts the teachings of Jesus in the Gospels.
How dare you state that to me. My position is not against the teachings of Jesus in the Gospels - yes I struggle like everyone else. It is the Church from the Pope down to the priests are not living or acting with the teachings of Jesus in mind. There are some wonderful priests - but a lot of bad ones. They have have done tremendous damage to the church in Ireland and turning people away from their faith and church. I think Glenn you need a strong dose of reality and stop quoting from the Gospel but actually get out there and see the hurt that the Church has done here in Ireland.
Hi Anonymous,
Please be assured that I didn't mean to offend you in any way. I am simply pointing out the teachings of the Catholic church.
It's not a matter of opinions- my opinion opposing yours---What I have stated is not my opinion, it is what Jesus stated and how He established His Church, and what the Catholic church teaches. We either give assent to what the Church teaches or we don't.
And I completelty acknowledge and understand that some preists and even bishops have commited horrible sins in Ireland and elsewhere--but we have to distinguish the Church from its members. The Church and its teachings come from God, and are therefore holy, its members on the other hand are frail and sinful.
We have to distinguish between the two, and not blame the Church itself for the faults of its members.
May God bless you and your loved ones.
-Glenn Dallaire
Though Jesus said to obey the priests and pharisees and Caiaphas, the apostles defied them in following Jesus.The priests and pharisees were saying Jesus is not the messiah and not to follow him.How would you explain that?
Hi Amy,
Thanks for your comment.
In Chapter 4 of the Acts of the Apostles, because they were "proclaiming in Jesus the resurrection of the dead" the Jewish leaders forbade Peter and John to preach in Jesus' holy Name.
The reason that God allowed them to disobey Caiphas, Annas and the other Jewish leaders is the very same reason that Jesus Himself did not obey the sanctions that they would have liked to place upon Him--and the reason is THAT NEITHER JESUS NOR THE APOSTLES WERE SUBJECTED TO THEIR AUTHORITY. Jesus was subjected to the authority of the Father, and the apostles were subjected to the authority of Jesus and His mandate to them ("...I give you the keys to the Kingdom of heaven....whatever you declare bound on earth" etc...)Matthew 16:18. The apostles were given the special mandate to share in Jesus' authority (Mt. 18:18)
However, we are not Jesus, nor have we been given the divine authority of the Apostles, so in our case Scripture teaches us that we Christians are subjected to the authority of Jesus THROUGH His representatives, the Bishops who are the successors to the apostles. In fact there are so many Scripture references to this point that I suggest that for a deeper understanding of the biblical teaching of Apostolic authority and succession one should read this:
APOSTOLIC AUTHORITY AND SUCCESSION -Scriptural documentation
Making oneself one's own judge and authority in the matters of christian faith and doctrine is the error of the Protestants. This error of making oneself one's own authority through self interpretation of the christian faith is why the Protestants have been fracturing and splitting into never ending denominations and sects for the past 500 years. Last count has over 30,000 different Protestant denominations and sects, all claiming to be the sole "authority" in the christian faith and scriptures....
Best wishes and may God bless you and your loved ones,
Glenn Dallaire
Hi Glenn and everyone else reading these posts.
Regarding the church and its Hierarchy in Ireland. Sure some people suffered , suffering inflicted by other people, albeit persons in postitions of trust. Yet I find if you compare the tragedies to the rest of the world, especially in the last century, then Ireland does not have that much to complain about. Millions of people died all over europe, asia , africa wehereas Ireland was enjoying a peaceful isolated existence, only disturbed by maybe one or two stray German bombs and an over eager IRA. The Church is nowadays made out to be a foreign institution manned by foreign people whereas, especially in Ireland, the church was "manned" by our own brothers, sisters, uncles and aunts. It was and is a family business. The perpetrators came out of our midst, so who are we blaming? We should be blaming our own society. We should ask the question " What is wrong with the Irish" and not so much " What is wrong with the church" This applies to other countries too. Ultimately humans are sinners and this is the reason for the existence of the Church. The church is a fishing net cast out by Jesus to catch ( Sinnful)Men. In Ireland we also want to blame someone as the Germans could blame the Nazis and Russians the Sovjets. Truth is "Mea culpa" is the realistic approach. Have a look at the atrocities being commited as we speak. Of all the abuse cases in Ireland only about 3% are down to Church officials. What about the rest, who speaks about them, who even cares about them? As they have no political anti-church value, they are never mentioned.
Hi Anonymous,
-Exellent point! It is wrong to blame the Church for the sinfulness of Its members. After all, the Church deeply rejects and condemns the sinful actions that these particular priests in Ireland committed.
After all, if a individual policeman commits a horrible crime, do we then blame the police department who naturally condemns such actions?
-Glenn Dallaire
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